BaoFengs are fine radios, but they don’t have hundreds of miles of range

In our online travels, we sometimes see preppers buying pairs of BaoFeng handi-talkies for themselves and their distant loved ones because they think they’ll be able to communicate over hundreds of miles in a grid-down. Nothing could be further from the truth. The BaoFeng’s range isn’t anywhere close to that.

Yes, the popular BaoFengs are amateur (ham) radios, and the right ham radio can indeed communicate over hundreds of miles. But BaoFeng handi-talkies are not the right radio for long-distance comms. So before you make any prepping plans that involve one of these devices, you should know what they can and cannot do, and why.

Here’s what you need to know:

  • BaoFengs use the very high frequency (VHF) and ultra-high frequency (UHF) parts of the spectrum, which are limited by terrain and only travel from one to ten miles under most normal conditions.
  • To make contacts hundreds of miles away, you need a high-powered, high frequency (HF) radio and a General license.
  • A BaoFeng handi-talkie using VHF maxes out at about 30 miles under ideal conditions and with a few tricks and tweaks.

Be sure to read our beginner’s guide to amateur (ham) radio for preppers for a better understanding of how these technologies work.

Popular BaoFeng radios
BaoFeng UV-5R
Best budget BaoFeng

BaoFeng UV-5R

An inexpensive VHF/UHF ham radio.
BaoFeng BF-F8HP
Premium BaoFeng

BaoFeng BF-F8HP

An upgrade to the classic BaoFeng UV-5R.
Not all ham radio is the same

It’s easy to see how people get confused about the BaoFeng’s range. When you think of ham radio, you probably picture a middle-aged guy in a shack with a table of electronic boxes and a big desk microphone, talking to people all over the world. That’s what’s known as high frequency, or HF communications, which take place between 3 and 30 MHz.

But HF is only a small slice of what ham radio is, and at least in the United States, it’s a pretty exclusive club. To make much use out of HF, you need two amateur radio licenses from the FCC: Technician, which is the entry-level license and General, which is the mid-level license.

If you have only the entry-level Technician license, you’re mostly stuck with the frequencies designated as Very High Frequency (VHF) and Ultra High Frequency (UHF), which is what your BaoFeng uses.

What’s the difference between VHF/UHF and HF? HF consists of longer electromagnetic waves that travel long distances. HF waves also can bounce off the earth’s ionosphere, which is how they can propagate all over the world. That’s called skywave propagation.

A diagram of skywave propagation

VHF and UHF have characteristics opposite those of HF. Such stations need to have a direct path between each other, with no major obstructions in between. VHF tends to have the greatest distance, so I’ll mostly focus on VHF from here on out.

A particular challenge for handheld radios like most BaoFengs is output power. BaoFeng handi-talkies tend to be rated at 5-8 watts, though the actual wattage tends to be lower. By comparison, most HF radios transmit at 100 watts and many mobile VHF radios transmit between 50-75 watts.

Don’t be fooled by clever YouTube videos

You might stumble across videos like this one: “Baofeng UV-5R ham radio, talking from Atlanta to Seattle” and be misled into thinking that a BaoFeng can reach such distances on its own.

To be clear, the guy in the video isn’t trying to be misleading. As he explains later in the video, he uses an internet-based system called EchoLink to expand his radio’s range. He transmits to an EchoLink-connected repeater in Atlanta, the signal travels along the internet to the EchoLink repeater in Seattle and transmits his signal over the air on the other end of the country.

You don’t even need a radio to try this out. There are free apps for iPhone and Android that you can use as long as you have a Technician license and internet access.

EchoLink is a neat technology, but it’s dependent on the internet, which defeats the grid-down preparedness purposes of ham radio. You might as well use an app like Zello and save money on the radios.

There are some other things that can propagate VHF/UHF signals much farther than usual, such as tropospheric ducting or bouncing signals off satellites. But both of those depend on specific conditions and may not always be possible. Those are definitely good things to know about, but when formulating an off-grid communications plan with loved ones, we want to zero in on simplicity and reliability.

Height is key

How can we overcome these limitations without resorting to the grid? There isn’t much to be done about power, other than buying a new radio, but there are a couple of other variables we can adjust. The most important of these is height.

I live in a valley far away from cities, and even with my best antenna—a truck-mounted Nagoya UT-72—there are very few repeaters I can even listen to. But if I climb up the steep hill behind my house, which raises my elevation by about 60 feet, suddenly an entire world of communications opens up, even with the lousy stock BaoFeng antenna. I can hit repeaters up to 34 miles away.

Great BaoFeng antennas
Nagoya UT-72
Best for your car

Nagoya UT-72

This is a reliable antenna that can be mounted on top of your vehicle. Great for a bug out, or for just driving up to the top of a hill to increase your range.
Nagoya NA-771
Best for most people

Nagoya NA-771

The gold standard in BaoFeng antennas, this antenna will get you the most out of your radio under the majority of circumstances.

The key to effective VHF/UHF communications is height. That’s why repeater towers are placed at high elevations and raised as high as possible.

You might think a longer antenna would help, but not as much as you’d think. I’ve tried several antennas on the hill, and none of them are dramatically better than the stock one. My longer whip antennas like the Nagoya NA-771 do a little better, and if I could get my slim-jim antenna high up in a tree to add more elevation, that would probably help even more, but the vast majority of the benefit comes just from climbing up the hill.

Realistic solutions for long-distance BaoFeng comms

Let’s circle back to your original problem: long-distance communications in a grid-down scenario. Obviously, your first and best options for disaster comms are telephone, internet, and satellite. Even in pretty severe disasters and civil wars, these services usually still work — satellite in particular will work even after most end-of-the-world-as-we-know-it scenarios. But we’ll stick to the BaoFeng handi-talkies here.

Provided your definition of “long-distance communications” is about 30 miles, then you can make the two-way VHF/UHF BaoFengs work. The key is wattage and elevation, both of which will require some experimentation with your communication partners. As with any troubleshooting, start with the easiest and cheapest things and move on from there.

Begin by just trying to communicate with your BaoFengs normally. It helps if you have a backup means of communicating like a phone. If that doesn’t work, try having one party and then another increase their elevation. If elevation doesn’t solve the problem, you’ll have to throw money at it, with higher-powered radios like the Yaesu FTM-3100R, which can transmit at up to 65 watts.

A high-powered mobile radio
Yaesu FTM-3100R

Yaesu FTM-3100R

A higher-powered mobile radio from a reliable brand. This is perfect for a bug out vehicle or a towable trailer. The higher wattage gives it far more range than the hand-held BaoFeng.

Don’t let me dissuade you from getting a BaoFeng and studying for your Technician license. But before you pull the trigger, understand that while the BaoFengs are useful radios, they won’t help you talk cross-country. Again, check out our guide to ham radio to better understand how all of this stuff works.


    • Mauricio Martinez

      You have to understand when they claim that kind of distance that’s because certain repeaters have that kind of distance and if the repeater is connected via All-Star Network or echo link we’re talking thousands of miles. But if you want point-to-point long distance communication without the third party in between then you have to go to the HF bands such as 20 m or 15 m 40 etc. I’ve been a ham radio operator since I was 16 years old and I’m 51 now so I’m very versed when it comes to technology more than the most out there do a little bit of research on repeater networks and how it works and repeaters that are also internet linked or linked via other radio’s networks for example the sarnet in Florida which is all linked via microwave to different repeaters so yes a baofang in Miami can talk  to Tallahassee

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      • Is it possible to use Baofeng with repeaters that aren’t on echo link? Like ones you can find on repeaterbook?

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      • Brian Charles 0rion86 _Bandito

        Yes it is, you can connect to most if not all 2 meter & 70cm repeaters although you will not be able to connect to DMR repeaters. 

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      • Josh CentersContributor Mauricio Martinez

        The only problem with repeaters is you don’t always know if you can count on them in an emergency, though many have backup power. That’s very cool about the microwave connection between repeaters, I’ll have to look into that more.

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      •  Is there a radio you recommend that can reach 350 miles without 3rd party stuff? My dad, 2 sisters and nephews and nieces are 326 miles away, my mom and younger sister is 172 and my in laws are 123. All by road not as the bird flies. I’d like to provide each house hold with 2 radios but everything I look up seams to be so contradicting. It’s be great if someone could say go get this and it be right. 

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      • Is there a radio you recommend that can reach 350 miles without 3rd party stuff? My dad, 2 sisters and nephews and nieces are 326 miles away, my mom and younger sister is 172 and my in laws are 123. All by road not as the bird flies. I’d like to provide each house hold with 2 radios but everything I look up seams to be so contradicting. It’s be great if someone could say go get this and it be right. 

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    • Brian Charles

      Have you ever tried to connect to the Mt Mitchell repeater in NC? We get quite a few check-ins from Tenn on Sat night @9 on the 6600 net… That repeater is mounted 6600′ up on the mountain which I suppose is the highest repeater on the east coast. Excellent article sir!!! 

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      • Josh CentersContributor Brian Charles

        Thank you! I’ll see if I can hit that repeater sometime, though I have a hard enough time hitting even local repeaters.

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    • checkthefacts

      The only thing to disagree with is that UHF cannot penetrate buildings better than VHF, the higher the frequency the more absorbtion by dense material so VHF would have a small edge. Sometimes rarely sporadic E propagation can increase the range of VHF and more commonly temperature/ humidity Inversion make a difference on VHF and UHF so it is not difficult to make contacts into the continent well over a hundred or two hundred miles from here in England

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      • Brian Asbury checkthefacts


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      • Josh CentersContributor checkthefacts

        Here’s the thing: we’re both right. Yes, higher frequencies tend to “bounce” off obstacles, but as the ICWE points out, shorter wavelengths can more easily slip through “holes” in buildings. Here in the states, VHF is vastly more popular than UHF, except in dense urban areas for that reason. Regardless, I’ll tweak the article to be more accurate.

        And you’re right that trophospheric ducting can greatly enhance transmission range on those frequencies, but it’s not something I would want to have depend on in an emergency. Granted, you’re also at nature’s mercy when using HF, but it more reliably travels long distances.

        Another reader mentioned bouncing signals off satellites, which is another viable option, though both parties have to keep track of the satellite’s position and either have a radio that can do VHF and UHF simultaneously (which the BaoFengs can’t do), or have two radios, one for transmission and another for reception. That’s definitely something I want to explore eventually, but it’s a bit complicated for the specific audience I was targeting here.

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    • Brian Asbury

      I think you have the characteristics of vhf and uhf backwards. Vhf is less sensitive to obstacles and uhf requires direct line of sight, which is why the military uses it for aviation. The higher the frequency the less distance and more attenuation there is, thus the higher uhf will attenuate faster.

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      • Josh CentersContributor Brian Asbury

        I mentioned this above, but UHF tends to be better at slipping through “holes” in buildings, despite its other drawbacks.

        6 |
    • JohnnyHam

      The bulk of every single “ham” radio user application is VHF/UHF.  It’s used in industry, forestry, etc…. Everywhere… It IS the meat and potatoes of ham radio.

      And ALL of those users, everywhere, using VHF/UHF, are using REPEATERS.

      Baofeng are JUST radios.  They’re the same as Motorola, Icom, etc.  And the key takeaway is that they are AFFORDABLE without sacrificing quality.  All Radios are the TI-89 calculators of the communications world…. They’re kind of overpriced 1980’s garbage.  In Baofeng’s case, they’re building a radio without the 10,000% profit margin of their American competition. Imagine if Sony came along and built a copy-cat TI-89 calculator and sold it to university students for 39.99$ instead of Texas Instruments at 149.99$.

      They ALL have the same range.

      They all use the same systems.

      Don’t write about how Baofeng don’t have the range of other radios… They’re identical.  Use a repeater like every other 400$ radio on the market does.

      Wanna talk about HF radio?  Baofeng are not even in the market.  But if they were, you can bet your butt they’re going to be at the same industry leading bargain as their VHF options.

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      • Josh CentersContributor JohnnyHam

        Yep, it’s all a limitation of VHF/UHF. Many hams say Yaesu and Icom radios have better range than BaoFengs, and maybe they do, but it’s not going to be miraculously better. I singled out BaoFengs in this article for the sole reason that I was seeing SO many posts in prepping groups about buying BaoFengs to talk to distant contacts and I wanted to correct the misconceptions.

        Xiegu is probably the closest thing to BaoFeng in the HF space, and they’re very good radios for what they are. Thanks for reading!

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    • Norvern

      Hi, I’d like to get some advice on which handset to get and which frequency to use to be able to contact my daughter in a shtf situation.

      We’d be communicating up to 15 miles, between semi rural and city locations.

      I’m looking for something simple that she can keep in her get home back, preferably runs on something like AA batteries, unless the battery pack has a decent lifespan if unused, or can be recharged by a USB power bank / hand crank / solar charger.

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    • Bulldog Brower

      Josh, I hope you follow up with an article on the popularity of GMRS radio. This little brother of ham radio is on fire right now. Manufacturers such as Baofeng, Retevis, Radioddity, and Wouxun have 5 watt GMRS handi talkies flying off the shelf. Some manufacturers have even produced 50 watt mobile units that can also be used as a base. These radios are all the rage because the license requires no testing. The GMRS license covers an entire family, even grandparents. The license cost is $70.00 now, soon to be reduced to $35.00. Here you have a radio with the same capabilities as UHF ham radio, with the bonus of GMRS also can use repeaters.

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      • Gideon ParkerStaff Bulldog Brower

        We totally agree with you that GMRS is a great solution that gives you something more powerful than a Walmart FRS walkie talkie but doesn’t require as much time, money, and knowledge as ham radio does. Plus the whole family can instantly hop onto it with you. 

        Josh did write up a good article about GMRS called: Why and how to get a GMRS license

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